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Great Western Coffee Shop
Recent Public Posts - [guest]
Re: MP bemused by lack of Ely North rail junction upgrade
In "The Wider Picture in the United Kingdom" [368907/31186/51]
Posted by Trowres at 21:49, 3rd December 2025
 
Gobsmacked that the cost of the project has risen from £25M to £500M - twentyfold - whilst the politicos have been faffing around without getting started.


I suspect that the £25m might refer to an earlier scheme limited to Ely North Junction, while the £500m scheme includes a lot more that was added to the scope when somebody found that  North Junction on its own wasn't sufficient to meet the objectives. There seems to  be a lot of level crossing work required, a new bridge and even new sections of road (if I scanned the text correctly).

I'm not sure when the Ely North Junction scheme was first proposed, but its implementation was postponed by the Hendy Review (November 2015) to sometime in 2019-2024 "to allow co-ordination with safety-critical level crossing works nearby".

New Civil Engineer provides some history on the scheme after that postponement:-

In 2018, a £9.3M funding package was provided to Network Rail by the Cambridgeshire and Peterborough Combined Authority, New Anglia Local Enterprise Partnership and the Strategic Freight Network. This enabled Network Rail to understand the requirements for increasing capacity through Ely and draw up a strategic outline outline business case (SOBC).

The SOBC then prompted a £13.1M funding agreement from the Department for Transport in autumn 2020 to develop design options and hold public consultations. These would inform the outline business case (OBC).

HOW MUCH? 
In the long and dreary way of planning infrastructure, an SOBC is an early stage, in which a problem is identified, possible solutions suggested and a rough idea obtained of how the costs and benefits weigh-up. It isn't meant to be super accurate, just good enough to see if its worth developing a scheme in more detail. "Cheap and cheerful" methods of estimating demand (for example) are allowed.

To give some idea of context, local authorities and other groups promoting Restoring Your Railway schemes typically had to make do with funding around £75,000. That could get you sufficient professional consultancy time to provide an SOBC to the required standard.

The wider scheme is a lot more complex than a single new station, but even so, how on earth did it cost over 120 times more to produce an SOBC?

I'm not sure if £13.1m for the next stage (OBC) represents better value-for-money. The detailed reports (SOBC and OBC) don't seem to be online. However an FoI request (not by me!) has provided a remarkably short document claiming to be the OBC (any of you remember being told off by teachers for failing to show your working leading up to an answer?). It's available at:
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/eace_ely_area_capacity_enhanceme/response/3035382/attach/html/5/FOI202500537%20EACE%20OBC%20Executive%20Summaries.pdf.html

WHERE RAIL SCHEMES GO TO DIE?
The New Civil Engineer continues the story:
The OBC was submitted to the DfT in March 2022, seeking funding to advance the programme.

The situation has since gone stale. The Combined Authority convened a summit in summer 2023 to revive the plans.

A few months later it was included in the haphazardly concocted Network North document put together by the Sunak government after the cancellation of HS2 north, though it did not set out any way to fund the scheme and no material advancement on the plans was made.

Suffolk Chamber of Commerce sought to garner support for the scheme for the 2024 spring Budget. There was no response.

A little more detail can be gleaned from a letter of 12th September 2022 from several MPs and others to government ministers of that time. I will quote only the relevant parts:
[The Ely and Haughley Junction schemes] have been identified as priorities within the Rail
Network Enhancements Pipeline, however, as yet have not received committed funding and have
been subject to considerable delay.
...
Wendy Morton MP, then Minister for Transport, included
welcome recognition of the “the benefit of the Ely programme and its strong alignment to the
Government’s priorities” and that “the programme continues to demonstrate sound
decarbonisation and connectivity benefits.”

But the same correspondence indicated the Department for Transport were considering cancelling
or indefinitely pausing some schemes within RNEP and instead would be exploring “opportunities to
realise at least some of the desired outcomes, either through wider operational changes to the
network or through smaller, targeted investment enabled by future funding settlements”.

This would be the RNEP that was introduced to replace the fixed 5-year enhancement plans of NR, and for which there was supposed to be an annual update plan, which has never appeared.

Of course, most of that history covered the previous, Conservative, government. Nice to see in the BBC article of 2nd December 2025 that the DfT said:
it recognised the scheme's importance and fully anticipated Ely North "will be part of a pipeline of projects to be considered as part of future funding decisions".

They added: "There is a strong case for Ely Junction, and we are committed to working with a broad range of stakeholders to support its inclusion in the future pipeline."


So, schemes can be delayed for years and things cost too much, before even the oft-blamed bats and council planners get a look-in.

----------
In case anyone wishes to follow up, the links are:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgr9rg5r42o
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-cambridgeshire-51659351
https://www.newcivilengineer.com/latest/dft-says-ely-junction-upgrade-to-be-considered-for-future-pipeline-as-local-mps-continue-push-31-07-2025/
https://www.elystandard.co.uk/news/20707553.threat-cancel-indefinitely-pause-450m-ely-rail-upgrade/
https://www.edp24.co.uk/news/23833666.government-confirms-ely-junction-rail-revamp-go-ahead/
https://www.elyeastcambsconservatives.org.uk/news/lucy-frazer-presses-action-ely-north-junction
https://www.flua.org.uk/fenman_pdf/The%20Fenman%202016%20No%201.pdf
https://www.georgefreeman.co.uk/sites/georgefreeman.co.uk/files/2022-09/final-signed-letter-re-ely-and-haughley-junctions-ee-appg.pdf
https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/eace_ely_area_capacity_enhanceme/response/3035382/attach/html/5/FOI202500537%20EACE%20OBC%20Executive%20Summaries.pdf.html
https://www.networkrail.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2019/06/hendy-report.pdf


Re: Cars getting bigger - is this a concern?
In "Buses and other ways to travel" [368906/31190/5]
Posted by broadgage at 21:26, 3rd December 2025
 
Yes the growing size of cars is a concern INHO. I consider that road tax should be based on dimensions or weight.
A substantial increase in fuel duty would also help.

Re: Cars getting bigger - is this a concern?
In "Buses and other ways to travel" [368905/31190/5]
Posted by Surrey 455 at 21:11, 3rd December 2025
Already liked by Western Pathfinder
 
We had a 1960 Mini in which we went on a holiday to Scotland, four of us and luggage. I still am not sure how we fitted in!

I'm not sure that the newer Mini's should be described as mini!

Re: South Western Railway train farewell tour sold out in just 15 seconds - Dec 2025
In "South Western services" [368904/31197/42]
Posted by Surrey 455 at 21:08, 3rd December 2025
 
I'm still using them on my morning commute. The evening return is either a 450 (horrible train - Cramped 3x2 seating)  or the new 701. What's good about the old 455s is that the seat width is slightly wider than the 701 and much wider than the 450. No toilets in the 455, 4 in an 8 carriage 450 and 2 in a 10 carriage 701. In Summer 2026 I will welcome the AC on the newer trains.

Re: Historic black and white pictures - where were they taken? - 3.12.2025
In "The Lighter Side" [368903/31189/30]
Posted by Ralph Ayres at 20:57, 3rd December 2025
 
8 is Sudbury & Harrow Road.  Date-wise, clues are that it's after the houses in the background had their leak-prone flat roofs replaced by pitched ones, but before the rotten wooden platforms were replaced by a central island where the through lines used to be, and I've also spotted the lamp-posts are not yet NSE red.  Some time late 1970s or early 80s, when I passed through on a daily basis?  Is the number of people waiting on the Down platform an indication of a rare event such as a steam special, or one of those bargain NSE "Network Days"?  Most of the low usage was and still is to/from Marylebone though I was an occasional exception back then making convoluted journeys between Acton and Denham.  That would also explain the presence of the photographer on what looks to be a fairly bleak day.

Re: Historic black and white pictures - where were they taken? - 3.12.2025
In "The Lighter Side" [368902/31189/30]
Posted by bradshaw at 20:23, 3rd December 2025
Already liked by Western Pathfinder
 
1 Crianlarich Lower station

Re: Historic black and white pictures - where were they taken? - 3.12.2025
In "The Lighter Side" [368900/31189/30]
Posted by grahame at 19:36, 3rd December 2025
 
Correct so far

2 - Masbury - Masbury, WSW Frome
3 - Melrose - Oxonhutch, mid '70s
5 - St Lawrence, Ramsgate
6 - Denton - Chris from Nailsea - quite recent
9 - Melksham - stuving
10 - Hunstanton - Andy E, circa 1967

Guesses for 1 and 4 are incorrect ... sorry

Re: Lower Thames Crossing, between Tilbury in Essex and Gravesend in Kent
In "The Wider Picture in the United Kingdom" [368899/30367/51]
Posted by stuving at 18:56, 3rd December 2025
 
There's a more technical article about it here from Born to Engineer:
The Lower Thames Crossing will consist of a 14.5-mile (23km) road linking the A2 and M2 in Kent with the A13 and M25 in Thurrock, Essex. The project’s centrepiece is a twin-bore tunnel under the River Thames between Gravesend in Kent and Tilbury in Essex.

At 2.6 miles (4.2km) long, these tunnels will become the longest road tunnels in the UK. Each tunnel will carry three lanes of traffic in one direction with a 70mph speed limit. Approximately 80% of the route will run through tunnels, cuttings, or embankments to minimize visual impact on the surrounding landscape.

The tunnels will be 16.4 meters (54 feet) in diameter, making them the longest among the country’s most extensive road tunnels. The significant diameter is required to accommodate three full traffic lanes in each direction while maintaining safety standards for modern highway design.

National Highways, which will oversee the project, plans to begin construction in 2026, with completion targeted for 2032. The project has been divided into three main construction packages:

    Roads North of the Thames: Balfour Beatty secured this £1.2 billion contract in January 2023 to construct 10 miles (16km) of highways connecting the M25 at Junction 29 and the A13 with the northern tunnel entrance.
    Kent Roads: In July 2023, Skanska was awarded this £450 million contract to build 3.7 miles (6.0km) of roads connecting the A2/M2 to the southern tunnel entrance.
    Tunnels and Approaches: In December 2023, a joint venture between Bouygues and J. Murphy & Sons won this £1.3 billion contract. To save engineering costs, the consortium plans to use a single tunnel boring machine for both tunnel bores, turning it around and reusing it after completing the first tunnel.

It says there that "the consortium plans to use a single tunnel boring machine for both tunnel bores, turning it around and reusing it", and there is more about that later on. I suspect that the final choice of reset method (that one, or take its head off and reverse out) will be for the makers to offer in their tender.

Re: South Western Railway train farewell tour sold out in just 15 seconds - Dec 2025
In "South Western services" [368898/31197/42]
Posted by bradshaw at 18:17, 3rd December 2025
 
I gather that the second one has also sold out!

Re: Historic black and white pictures - where were they taken? - 3.12.2025
In "The Lighter Side" [368897/31189/30]
Posted by bradshaw at 18:09, 3rd December 2025
Already liked by Mark A
 
This article, from the BBC, shows parts of the S&DJR as they are today. Masbury station is about halfway down

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/c78m3vv9d1zo

South Western Railway train farewell tour sold out in just 15 seconds - Dec 2025
In "South Western services" [368896/31197/42]
Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 18:05, 3rd December 2025
 
From the BBC:



Tickets to a farewell event for commuter trains which are due to be phased out in Surrey were sold out in just 15 seconds, according to South Western Railway (SWR).

The tour on 21 December will bid farewell to SWR's Class 455 trains, which have served some of Berkshire, South West London and Surrey's busiest stations since 1983.

The company said more than 9,000 customers tried to buy just 400 tickets for a special charter service which will stop at places including Epsom and Haslemere.

In response to the "unprecedented demand", SWR and the Branch Line Society said they would run a second train as part of the farewell tour.

Lawrence Bowman, managing director of SWR and Network Rail Wessex Route, said they have been "amazed at the level of interest".

The company added a limited number of tickets for the second train went on sale on Tuesday, and were "also expected to sell out".

"Knowing there are so many enthusiasts who want to be part of this special occasion, we're pleased to run a second train," Mr Bowman added.

The money will go towards Macmillan, The Alex Wardle Foundation and Railway Children, SWR says.

SWR says the Class 455 trains will be retired by the end of 2025 as the company rolls out more of its Arterio trains.

Tickets to the farewell event cost £45.50.

A total of 70 Class 455 trains were built by British Rail Engineering Ltd and came into service on suburban routes in March 1983.

During the farewell event, the first train will leave at 09:32 GMT, followed by the second train at 10:35 GMT.


Re: Historic black and white pictures - where were they taken? - 3.12.2025
In "The Lighter Side" [368895/31189/30]
Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 17:46, 3rd December 2025
 
Of course that one might be a recent colour picture - even as recent as last year - which has had the colours drained away quizmagisterially.

Whoever would do such a thing ?? 

Re: Children to get free bus travel for the summer - Bristol, 2025
In "Buses and other ways to travel" [368894/30338/5]
Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 17:41, 3rd December 2025
 
From the BBC:

Children in and around Bristol can ride buses for free this Christmas



Children will be able to use buses for free again after a successful summer scheme saw more than 900,000 young people take part.

A successful summer holiday project led to thousands of free journeys being taken every week in Bristol, South Gloucestershire, North Somerset and Bath and North East Somerset.

Kids Go Free will start up again over the Christmas holidays for children under 16 from 20 December to 4 January 2026.

Helen Godwin, Mayor of the West of England, said: " With more and more new green electric buses coming, we will keep working together to build the bus network that local people need and deserve. "




Re: Cars getting bigger - is this a concern?
In "Buses and other ways to travel" [368893/31190/5]
Posted by bobm at 17:39, 3rd December 2025
 
It was a regular haunt of my parents when I was a child.  I remember fishing from the end of the pub garden with a makeshift rod.   Never caught anything, but did impale my finger on the hook several times!  Also remember the juke box in the conservatory.  It always seemed to be playing "Tie a Yellow Ribbon".


'Beetle and Wedge Boathouse' at Moulsford, on the River Thames
In "Buses and other ways to travel" [368892/31190/5]
Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 17:26, 3rd December 2025
 
My favourite restaurant, the Beetle & Wedge at Moulsford (where there was once a ferry across the Thames) ...

I'm glad to see they are still going strong.

Some 50 years ago, when I was a teenager, our family enjoyed several annual holidays in hired wooden cabin cruisers on the River Thames (based around Bourne End, where my grandparents lived) and we enjoyed several meals in the Beetle and Wedge.

CfN. 

Re: Lower Thames Crossing, between Tilbury in Essex and Gravesend in Kent
In "The Wider Picture in the United Kingdom" [368891/30367/51]
Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 16:58, 3rd December 2025
 
From the BBC:

Lower Thames Crossing tunnelling 'to begin in 2028'



The tunnelling process for the Lower Thames Crossing is due to begin in 2028.

National Highways said negotiations to buy one of the world's largest tunnelling machines were now under way.

It would be capable of digging 60 metres below the Thames, creating a new road link between Essex and Kent, and now enables the project to secure private sector investment to deliver the remainder of the construction.

Next summer, work on the northern tunnel entrance where the tunnel machine will begin its journey will get under way.

Matt Palmer, the Highways Agency's executive director of the Lower Thames Crossing project, said the crossing was now on track to be built "in the early 2030s".

The 16.4-metre-wide tunnel boring machine will excavate one of the widest tunnels in the world and it will create the longest road tunnel in the UK.

Tenders are now being welcomed from prospective suppliers who could build the tunnel boring machine.


Re: Historic black and white pictures - where were they taken? - 3.12.2025
In "The Lighter Side" [368890/31189/30]
Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 16:45, 3rd December 2025
Already liked by Timmer
 
Chris from Nailsea will be gutted if there’s no historic picture of Taunton for him to take a guess at.

Ahem.

I never guess at pictures of Taunton, because I know that they are not ... until I'm usually proved wrong.


Re: Historic black and white pictures - where were they taken? - 3.12.2025
In "The Lighter Side" [368889/31189/30]
Posted by stuving at 16:41, 3rd December 2025
Already liked by grahame, Oxonhutch
 
6.  Denton station, near Manchester.

It hasn't changed much, over the years, but I'm struggling with a possible date for a black and white photo of it.

A wild guess, therefore: 1970?

Of course that one might be a recent colour picture - even as recent as last year - which has had the colours drained away quizmagisterially.

Children hurt as school bus roof ripped off by bridge - Lancashire, Dec 2025
In "The Wider Picture in the United Kingdom" [368888/31196/51]
Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 16:28, 3rd December 2025
 
From the BBC:



Several children have been hurt after the roof of a school double-decker bus was ripped off when it hit a low bridge.

Among the injured was an eight-year-old boy who was taken to hospital with a "non-serious" head injury following the crash on Spendmore Lane, Coppull, Lancashire, at about 12:30 GMT.

The bus was carrying some pupils from Wood Fold Primary School, in Standish, Wigan, the BBC understands. The school declined to comment.

Paramedics assessed the children at the scene and all but the eight-year-old boy were discharged from their care, North West Ambulance Service said. Emergency services remain at the scene and a road closure is in place.



"A number of children suffered injuries, which are thankfully thought to be relatively minor at this time," Lancashire Police said.




Re: Cars getting bigger - is this a concern?
In "Buses and other ways to travel" [368887/31190/5]
Posted by Mark A at 15:41, 3rd December 2025
 
It's one of the quoted reasons that the urban bus service route here has been shortened and become less convenient - buses no longer able to keep to time as given that cars have grown, there's less road space for the buses, so, a bit of a doom loop going on there.

Mark

Naming - appropriate?
In "The Lighter Side" [368886/31195/30]
Posted by grahame at 15:23, 3rd December 2025
 
From The National

The public have voted for the names of seven new loch-class ferries being built at Remontowa Shipyard in Gdansk, Poland, as part of the Small Vessel Replacement Programme.

The vessels will serve key routes including Colintraive-Rhubodach, Lochaline-Fishnish, Tarbert-Portavadie, Iona-Fionnphort, Sconser-Raasay, Tobermory-Kilchoan and Tayinloan-Gigha.

More than 1000 votes were cast over three weeks, with members of the public choosing their seven favourite names from a list of 17 options provided by CMAL.

The new Scottish ferry names are:
MV Loch Awe – MV Loch Obha
MV Loch Etive – MV Loch Èite
MV Loch Katrine – MV Loch Ceiteirein
MV Loch Maree – MV Loch Ma-Ruibhe
MV Loch Morar – MV Loch Mòrair
MV Loch Rannoch – MV Loch Raineach
MV Loch Shiel – MV Loch Seile

I know some of these lochs as fresh water ones - are the all fresh water?? And yet the ferries to be named are all to sail on salt water.    Would not naming them after salt water lochs be more appropriate?

Imagine the express trains for Paddington to the South West being named after rivers in East Anglia.


Re: Historic black and white pictures - where were they taken? - 3.12.2025
In "The Lighter Side" [368885/31189/30]
Posted by WSW Frome at 15:11, 3rd December 2025
Already liked by grahame
 
After the hint, No 2 is Masbury. The picture looks like a postcard and one can only guess at the 1950's.

Lengthy train, 03/12/2025
In "London to the Cotswolds" [368884/31194/14]
Posted by Witham Bobby at 14:51, 3rd December 2025
 
According to RTT, 1W25 1252 Paddington to Foregate Street today has 18 cars.  Formed of two 9-car units, 802112 and 802113

Re: Historic black and white pictures - where were they taken? - 3.12.2025
In "The Lighter Side" [368883/31189/30]
Posted by PrestburyRoad at 14:34, 3rd December 2025
Already liked by Witham Bobby
 
Going back to 9, that building looks just like the survivor at the eastern end of Stroud station - and long may that continue as an example of Brunel's work.

Re: Track defect at Plymouth - November 2025
In "Shorter journeys in Plymouth and Cornwall" [368882/31121/25]
Posted by GBM at 14:28, 3rd December 2025
 
Cancellations to services between Par and Plymouth
Due to a points failure at Plymouth the line is blocked. Disruption is expected until 15:45 03/12.
Train services between Par and Plymouth may be cancelled or delayed.
Customer Advice
Train services running between Plymouth and the Cornwall are being severely delayed due to a points failure west of Plymouth Station. Engineers from Network Rail are attending, but the fix is likely to take some time. We are currently looking at how best to support customers currently affected, but customers intending to travel may wish to postpone their plans if they are able to.
(Issued 1407 today)

No Gunnislake branch running currently.
2P10 1129 Truro to Plymouth stuck at Albert Road since 1247.
2P13 1229 Truro to Plymouth stuck at Liskeard since 1317.

Liskeard to Looe branch also shut - flooding.

5Z61 1236 Plymouth to Liskeard (175009) parked Up Lostwithiel goods loop

Re: Historic black and white pictures - where were they taken? - 3.12.2025
In "The Lighter Side" [368881/31189/30]
Posted by Witham Bobby at 14:25, 3rd December 2025
 
6.  Denton station, near Manchester.

It hasn't changed much, over the years, but I'm struggling with a possible date for a black and white photo of it.

A wild guess, therefore: 1970?

Winter-time.  To judge from the salt that's been broadcast on the stairs and platform

Re: Traffic delays in Bristol as bus gets stuck on tight bend - December 2025
In "The West - but NOT trains in the West" [368880/31192/31]
Posted by stuving at 14:20, 3rd December 2025
 
I think Google streetview shows the bus is actually on (or just coming off) a side road:
https://maps.app.goo.gl/mLaus6bfQRBEAf8P8

That sign is for a little park homes estate up there. The driver has done quite well to get in and turn round again, since the roads are very narrow and steep. That entry was by the shallow angle turn off; exiting via the sharp turn looks as if it was never on. The real question is of course "why?"

Re: Historic black and white pictures - where were they taken? - 3.12.2025
In "The Lighter Side" [368879/31189/30]
Posted by stuving at 14:12, 3rd December 2025
 
I've seen picture 9 before. I guess there are only so many old photos of Melksham available.
Ha - I was going to post that Google Lens was a good way to identify the locations in these photos (after they'd all been identified). But in fact Lens first told me (confidently) it was Alveston, then Google AI told me it was Bilston Central To be fair, I didn't recognise it either, despite having passed through it this morning - it's definitely changed

A slightly larger version of that photo appears here http://www.savethetrain.org.uk/oldpics2.html which might have been where you saw it.

I've seen it on here, probably in another quiz or maybe just 'cos it's Melksham.

Its date? later than you'd guess at first sight. That railway layout was largely the same from the late 1800s (the footbridge the photo was taken off was a bit later) to the 1960s. But the vehicles in the yard at the back are right for about 1960. So late 50s  seems likely.

Hull bus ticket discount for city travel over Christmas 2025
In "Buses and other ways to travel" [368878/31193/5]
Posted by Chris from Nailsea at 14:04, 3rd December 2025
 
From the BBC:



Discounted bus tickets are in place for people travelling across Hull over Christmas.

The Hull Bus Alliance announced a group travel discount which started on Monday and will end on 31 December.

Stagecoach East Midlands and East Yorkshire Buses are offering the Hull Card Group ticket for up to five people for £7. It is usually priced at £14.90.

Councillor Mark Ieronimo, cabinet portfolio holder for transport and infrastructure at Hull City Council, said the scheme would help with the cost of living and "tackle issues of congestion".

The ticket can be used an unlimited number of times on Stagecoach or East Yorkshire buses in Hull on the day of purchase.

Ben Gilligan, managing director at East Yorkshire Buses, said: "This will allow families and friends to choose the sustainable option and avoid the frustration of sitting in traffic and paying for parking whilst also receiving excellent value bus travel."


 
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